Jags indeed interested in Taylor, but is he long for the NFL?
[UPDATED FOLLOWING THE WEDNESDAY MORNING NFC COACHES' BREAKFAST]
Last week I told you in this forum that Jacksonville coach Jack Del Rio was interested in the idea of trading for Jason Taylor, according to two league sources. I told you I would try to flush the issue out further at the NFL annual meetings.
Mission accomplished.
Although Del Rio has deflected several attempts to pin him down on the matter publicly, I've confirmed that the coach not only likes the idea of trading for Taylor, but also for Carolina's Julius Peppers -- whichever might be the best deal in his mind.
Realizing there are folks thinking about Peppers, Carolina coach John Fox on Wednesday morning basically told them to look elsewhere: "I love Julius Peppers," Fox said. "We are not looking to trade Julius Peppers. We want him with us for some years to come. He did not have his best season a year ago. I won't argue that. He won't argue that. But we're ready to move on."
If Del Rio can't find a way to add one of those two premier pass-rushers, he'll continue his search through other means because he figures his team is a fine pass-rusher from being a legitimate Super Bowl contender.
Del Rio has declined to speak on the record about either Taylor or Peppers. But he's made no secret of the Jags' need to find a defensive end.
"We're going to do the best we can with the people we have but we’re not done collecting the people we’re going to have in 2008," Del Rio said Tuesday. "There are always a combination of ways that you can disrupt the quarterback. And the number of sacks is not the most important thing, disruption of the quarterback is the most important thing whether we’re bringing blitzes, whether we’re using waves of people, whether we end up with a player or two who can legitimately get after the quarterback.
"We're going to find a way and we’re very open minded in terms of how we’re going to go about it and going to find a way to make sure we disrupt the quarterback and the timing of what they want to do offensively."
The Jaguars have no intention of giving up a first round pick for that pass rusher if he comes in trade. They also don't want to give up their second round pick. They seem open to the idea of giving up a third rounder.
Obviously Carolina seems intent on keeping Peppers, if one believes Fox. The Dolphins also have expressed their desire to keep Taylor, as both Bill Parcells and coach Tony Sparano have made that point.
But the situation is simply different for Miami so it might be more inclined to settle for a second round pick for Taylor.
Unlike Peppers, who is 28, Taylor will be 34 next season. It is simply logical that a team in rebuilding mode, a team that wants to acquire draft picks, would consider moving a 34-year-old player. Not to do that is stubborn.
Also, based on what I've been told about Taylor's future goals -- which today are to play in 2008 then really, really seriously consider retirement thereafter to enter show business -- it would seem to be a grave mistake to hang on to him.
Let's hope the Dolphins don't outsmart themselves because this is the first significant test of the personnel prowess for the new Bill Parcells regime - ahead of the upcoming draft even. How the regime handles this matter will determine the initial grade it receives as it tries to rebuild.
It should be interesting.
Last week I told you in this forum that Jacksonville coach Jack Del Rio was interested in the idea of trading for Jason Taylor, according to two league sources. I told you I would try to flush the issue out further at the NFL annual meetings.
Mission accomplished.
Although Del Rio has deflected several attempts to pin him down on the matter publicly, I've confirmed that the coach not only likes the idea of trading for Taylor, but also for Carolina's Julius Peppers -- whichever might be the best deal in his mind.
Realizing there are folks thinking about Peppers, Carolina coach John Fox on Wednesday morning basically told them to look elsewhere: "I love Julius Peppers," Fox said. "We are not looking to trade Julius Peppers. We want him with us for some years to come. He did not have his best season a year ago. I won't argue that. He won't argue that. But we're ready to move on."
If Del Rio can't find a way to add one of those two premier pass-rushers, he'll continue his search through other means because he figures his team is a fine pass-rusher from being a legitimate Super Bowl contender.
Del Rio has declined to speak on the record about either Taylor or Peppers. But he's made no secret of the Jags' need to find a defensive end.
"We're going to do the best we can with the people we have but we’re not done collecting the people we’re going to have in 2008," Del Rio said Tuesday. "There are always a combination of ways that you can disrupt the quarterback. And the number of sacks is not the most important thing, disruption of the quarterback is the most important thing whether we’re bringing blitzes, whether we’re using waves of people, whether we end up with a player or two who can legitimately get after the quarterback.
"We're going to find a way and we’re very open minded in terms of how we’re going to go about it and going to find a way to make sure we disrupt the quarterback and the timing of what they want to do offensively."
The Jaguars have no intention of giving up a first round pick for that pass rusher if he comes in trade. They also don't want to give up their second round pick. They seem open to the idea of giving up a third rounder.
Obviously Carolina seems intent on keeping Peppers, if one believes Fox. The Dolphins also have expressed their desire to keep Taylor, as both Bill Parcells and coach Tony Sparano have made that point.
But the situation is simply different for Miami so it might be more inclined to settle for a second round pick for Taylor.
Unlike Peppers, who is 28, Taylor will be 34 next season. It is simply logical that a team in rebuilding mode, a team that wants to acquire draft picks, would consider moving a 34-year-old player. Not to do that is stubborn.
Also, based on what I've been told about Taylor's future goals -- which today are to play in 2008 then really, really seriously consider retirement thereafter to enter show business -- it would seem to be a grave mistake to hang on to him.
Let's hope the Dolphins don't outsmart themselves because this is the first significant test of the personnel prowess for the new Bill Parcells regime - ahead of the upcoming draft even. How the regime handles this matter will determine the initial grade it receives as it tries to rebuild.
It should be interesting.
posted by Armando Salguero at 10:43 PM
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53 Comments:
I have to say Mando, it's nice to see you bringing A game again. It's been a while since I've seen multiple, meaningul posts from this blog in quick succession, not to mention in one day. Thanks.
Good stuff today, Armando. I just want Jason Taylor gone. He doesn't care about this team anymore, it should be abundently clear to everyone that his heart is in Hollywood, not South Florida. Get what you can, while you can!
whys every1 alwaus jump all over armando hes really not that bad...theres not a whole lot of news u can get from the dolphins right now....they suck and they know it...i am a die hard dolphins fan but they have no shot for years and will mess up the first pick and not take jake long like they should
I hate to see Taylor go but if it's indeed true that he doesn't plan on playing past this year then I'd say a 2nd rounder is a fair trade.
This tid-bit must drive the Dolfins crazy. Great stuff however. One and done is no-good for Miami. Damn Sal you may have single handily made the deal. Call Jack and see if the Jags would trade 26 for 32 this year and a thrid rounder for one of our 6th pick this year. That would give us 1,26,
and 58, 95, and 120 (I'm close with the numbers maybe not exact) you see what I mean. I'm convinced its Jake Long, Chad Henne, or Johnathan Stewart. I'm not sure Henne gets by San Fan or Green Bay at 29 and 30th pick. They've both shown interest in Henne. Moving to 26th negates that. God help us a Big Blue Lt and QB. I still like Beck. I've seen them both throw in person. It still seems like a pitance for JT. a 2nd round pick and a player would seem more fair then swap 31 and 26. SteFin
Great stuff Armando. Keen insight. I must say...it is a sad reality though.
Stefin...I like your idea, but would rather we take B. Albert with the 26th if he's there.
I also like this scenario:
Trade JT to Dallas for one of their first rounders, and we can throw in our second 2nd rounder.
That would give us 1, 22 or 28, and 32!
Now THAT makes me giddy!
The Dolphins do not have to trade JT period. Giving a draft pick away and JT is ludicrous. You sound alot like Wanny. If Jacksonville really wants JT then they are going to have to do alot more than a 3rd round pick LOL. Parcells will never make that trade. This is a player that won the defensive player of the year. No way is Parcells going with anything less than multiple picks and at least a 2nd rounder. If they don't want to pay up for an elite pass rusher then I guess they really don't want one. Let them try there luck in the draft at their selection.
I just don't understand this urge that people have to see the Dolphins trade away JT at all costs. If a third rounder is the best the Dolphins can get, then he is worth more to them as a Dolphin. If he retires after 2008, so be it (though I doubt he will leave an estimated $8M on the table to go into show business).
At the end of the day, it comes down to VALUE. There's very little value to be had in a fire sale.
so in your mind mando no matter what they do they are doomed. Trade him and its probably giving him away keep him and they are keeping and old guy on the team. You just know how to complain.
Ok, if Peppers is available, why don't we trade for him and keep Taylor? Our running game is very good with Ronnie Brown if healthy. Having Taylor and Peppers rushing the QB from both sides makes our secondary 10 times better. Crowder is ready to handle the MLB spot. Peppers is 28 years old and in his prime. A year older than Beck I might add. If Carolina wants a second rounder, Id find it difficult to believe we would draft anyone near Peppers quality in the second round. We have the cap space to give him a long term deal. Draft Gohlston with the first pick and put him outside and you have all kinds of pressure coming at the other QB. If Peppers can be had for a second round pick, you have to believe NE will be all over that.
Armando
You cross dresser.
Why are you always so negative.
Could it be you are a Patriots fan.
Dolpinaddict
Why would we trade for Peppers? We are drafting Chris Long (seems most likely), and this year's second round is actually regarded by experts to be the best second round talent in many years or maybe even ever. Second Round picks are so valuable this year.
I just think we draft draft draft. It would be great to get a hold of Atlanta's second round picks. They are poised to have a great draft.
i dont think we should take c.long he wont be that good of a player in the next level, i think we should go with gholston he may not be as good right away but within 2 yrs he will be a monster, look at what he benched and he got crazy upside, id rather take an avarage player with the potential to be great than a good player that will never be anything more that "good"
Gholston will NOT be chosen over C. Long by the 'Fins - not w/ Long's pedigree & the Al Groh/Parcells connection. Forget Gholston. I believe that a 2nd or a 3rd and 5th would be a good deal for the 'Fins. We picked up L. Booker in the 3rd last year & I'm pretty sure we've drafted a good player in the 5th round before... remember? JT has no value to us once he's retired. Get what you can for him now and hope you hit on your picks.
A-
Luckily, you are not making the decisions. It takes more than being strong to be an effective LB. Gholston looked very stiff in the hips during his workout at LB. Also his production in college was sporadic. Every year there is 2-3 guys that have freakish combine statistics that don't pan out and Gholston could be it this year. Long, however, matches strong production with great athletism. (Which by the way is a big focus of Jeff Ireland). Chris Long was rated a top 3 pick BEFORE the combine based on his production, motor, and character. What people did not know was how athletic he was. 6'3, 272 pounds. 4.7 40 yard dash, 35 inch verticle, great short shuttle, etc. Also the smoothest LB/DE moving back and forth, side to side. He played DT, DE, and some outside rush in college. This guy is the real deal. Do you really want to commit $35 million guaranteed to a guy who takes plays off in Gholston?
gholston was only a junior and with the right coaching trust hell be a force long may have all the pedigree and coaches helping but all iam saying is that i think gholston will be a much better player and i think he would fit at DE better than LB, long aint strong enough, fast enough, he has the passion, and effort but like i said hell be above avarage at best, i'd rather dorsey than long, c.long to me is the 3 or 4th best player
When you think of Chris Long, do you think of him holding out? I bet his contract is worked out and ready before the draft, like Mario Williams. Do you see Chris Long reacting negatively to a financial windfall that comes his way?
Do you see Chris Long being a POSITIVE member of the community and reflecting well on the community in the way Jason Taylor has?
I think this $35M goes beyond need, talent, and value on the field. It is $35M!!! Chris Long is the kind of MAN that makes the team and city better because he is in it.
Chris Long will redeem his value to the city and the organization. ANd talent and need being equal with Jake, Gholston, Dorsey, or even McFadden, can you see how Chris Long, community, character guy from Howie Long's genes, is the right choice for Miami?
At this pay scale, the talent doesn't vary much in the top five picks. Any of the top linemen should be a good NFL player, but now you are paying more for something that goes beyond rushing the passer or blocking.
Those qualities set Chris Long apart.
A-
Gholston is way too small as a 3-4 DE. He will have to play 3-4 OLB. Stuffing the run is just as important for a DE/LB as rushing the QB. If you can't stop the run then teams don't need to pass. I don't know why you think Gholston is that much better of an athlete than Long. I am a draft nerd so I watched the combine, the tapes, etc. Long is much smoother of an athlete, almost as fast, and a good leaper. He has instincts, knows how to use leverage, etc. I will give you this, if the QB is 40 yards away, then Gholston is your man. If you need to move 37 225 pound weight bars out of the way, Gholston is your man. If you need a great football player AND great athlete, C. Long is the choice!!
theres no debating long is the better player today but in 2-3yrs will you still be saying the same thing???? gholston has more upside he will grow much more than long, c.long is as good as hes going to be, look at the stats ghloston produced more at a younger age than long and theres no arguing that
Anonymous from last post...
How do you know Chris Long is as good as he is going to be?
You mean he will step out on the field day one and never get any better?
They said so much of the same things about Zach Thomas.
But it just confuses me how people take the fact that Gholston can improve more, if that is even a fact, and twist that into saying Chris Long has already reached his potential. If Chris Long is a top five player now, how can you say he is already maxed his potential. That argument sounds incomprehensible.
Trade JT to the Jags.
Swap our #2 for there #1(110pts) pluse there #3(145pts) & #4 (48pts). Using the trade chart that equals(total 302) a late 2nd(#59).
We move up and pick up two extra picks and the Jags feel good/like they got a good deal. Win Win for all.
#1 Jake Longe
#26 Brandon Albert
OL taken care of.
I would trade JT but only for a low first round or second round pick and certainly not to the Pats!
Hey Armando, whats up with Pacman Jones saying the Dolphins are one of the teams interested in him? Any word on that?
TheGreatest13
Armando,
Glad to see you finally acknowleged that management has serious reservations about keeping Joey "Throw him out with the Trash" Porter for the current season. As you know, I have been posting about this for months. The weakness at linebacker have been largely due to his lack of contribution to the team.
I agree it is likely the Fins will have to keep their #1 pick due to the lack of compelling talent this year and the associated expense of signing a first pick. Given that the GM acknowledged that we have significant holes on the offensive line (no surprise to anyone except Rex Hadnot), I expect them to take offensive tackle Jake Long. The defensive choices may not become proven impact players and if Beck is going to have any chance of developing into a good QB, we need a major upgrade on the OL and that cannot be accomplished with 2nd, 3rd or 4th round choices in the draft. He is the safe choice for tying up long term money. The Fins cannot afford to make a mistake with this year's first pick.
Steve,
I am trying to find Armando's acknowledgement of management's reservations about keeping Porter this year.
Can you provide a link for this? I don't see it in the current post.
I only read where Sparano had him penciled in as a starter.
I think he will be a solid player this year as he was when the season wound down last year and he was being used properly.
That being said, I believe he was overpaid, but I don't think it means he gets cut.
It would be nice if Taylor just demanded to be traded! The Fins are in the rebuilding stage that will last for at least 3yrs. So why would Taylor want to be apart of that at 34yrs.old. He has to be honest with himself. The Jags or Eagles would be a good fit!
RonCharlotte you sound like Coach Cam with all that community member crap. We need a football player, not a diplomat, not Ted Ginn's family, but a dominating force for 10 years. The o line is the area in most need right now, can't build a whole new D in one season. I look for them taking either J Long or McFadden, either will help take pressure off the quarterback. 5 pro bowls later, they can worry about helping the community.
nice play on words armando to make it look as though you know what you speak of nothing in those quotes prove a thing you claim
Golhston is astiff and time will prove it, mark my words and McFadden, is he gonna be another Reggie Bush or Adrian Peterson? I bet he'll be another Bush.
Armando,
Grading by whom, exactly?
By the all savvy media?
It seems, Armando, you are really pushing this Taylor trade.
Why is that?
oscar_g
Zolo,
I appreciate what you are saying. My point is at that price, the big picture matters. Look what manning did for Indy besides his talent. Having a member of the community that people are proud of also sells Jerseys seats and beers.
This is a big investment, and McFadden is waste of that money.
Hey if it is Jake Long, fine I will not be upset.
But Jake Long Chris Long and Gholston are a toss-up. That being said, I go with Chris because of the person he is and we know WHERE he comes from.
Oh and I wouldn't mind drafting Chris Long's Family. Howie could probably still hurt somebody.
If there is ANYBODY that should be traded, for anything we can get just to get get him off the roster, is another Jason.
Jason Allen.
1st round money. Very little production.
Sorry, Armando.
You are pushing for the wrong Jason.
oscar_g
Ron,
You're right. I would love to draft the Long family.
oscar_g
Well, the 1st overall pick makes for interesting debate, but I have no doubt the Tuna and Company with all their years of experience are way ahead of all of us bloggers when it comes to evaluating talent and predicting who will give us the best bang for the buck. I said the same thing last year too about the former staff, and while most of you will probably disagree with their choices, according to what Sparano is saying now, looks like Ginn is coming around, and the jury is still out on Beck (and Quinn). No matter who they pick, I'll support their choice until proven otherwise.
Amen Zolo,
Good stuff. The first time I have felt the urge to post on here in a bit. I agree that the new brass is great at evaluating talent. It is possible that we could be very surprised by the pick. I know there are a lot of Jake Long fans but with Sparano on staff he could have his eye on someone he feels he could develop beyond Long for less money. Of course only time will tell. I can not wait to see what happens.
Keep Jason Taylor. Send the #2 to Charlotte for Peppers. Send a 4th to Titans for PacMan. Draft Gohlston #1. That defense just went from old, to young and very strong against the pass. Pacman shuts down one side of the field and we havent had that since, well we had two of those guys named Madison and Surtain. Pacman is 25, Peppers is 28, Gohlston is 22, Crowder is 25, Starks is 24, Jason Allen is 25 and turning out to be a good free safety despite common misperception, the foundation would be there for a championship level defense, and thats not throwing picks away, thats trading for 2 players in their prime that have longevity left to bolster the defense in much needed areas.
Jeremy,
You posted several times yesterday, and even one Armando deleted.
Just sayin....
Some people just have no reading and comprehension skills. It cleary states in this blog that Fox has no intention of giving up Peppers, yet people are proposing trades as though he were available, and as well that Carolina would just automatically accept whatever trade we offer. I read just yesterday that the high school drop out rate is over 50% in several major cities. Now I believe it.
Ron,
You seem like an intelligent guy. Why not process what I wrote and really think about it. Does "bit" not imply a short period of time? I will no longer elaborate though or I then leave a post of the kind that kept me from this blog all day. LOL
Zolo,
You may already be aware but I should warn if you are not. Get used to it on this blog. It is by no means the fault of Armando but for some reason it is typically fool of irrelevant posts full of profanity and ignorance. Armando must have already gone through and deleted them all by now. But I like what you have to say you seem to be intelligent and understand the game of football from the few posts I have read.
hA hA Jeremy, just having some fun;)
Armando,
The word is "flesh".
I know. Actually Mando has zapped a few of my own replies. Not because of profanity though, I guess my criticism didn't jive to well with him.
Armando,
You really need to get off this topic. You've ridden this horse into the ground. You called it wrong and its time to admit your mistake and move on! Give us all something new and more interesting to talk about.
Mike in Denver
Mike In Denver: I've called a lot of things wrong, no doubt. But there is nothing about the current Jason Taylor story I've been wrong about, buddy.
"Also, based on what I've been told about Taylor's future goals -- which today are to play in 2008 then really, really seriously consider retirement thereafter to enter show business -- it would seem to be a grave mistake to hang on to him.?"
Wow Armando! IF that is true what FFing good would it be to put that out there. He wouldn't be a 4th rounder if he is only going to play 1 year then go be a movie star. In that case we can keep him and have him groom a new OLB.
Why not trade Jason Taylor (age:34) to the Philadelphia Eagles for Lito Shepard (age: 26) and replace Taylor with C. Long !!
I think the Eagles (DEF COR : JIMMY JOHNSON) would love to have Jason .
I love JT, but I don't see him as a movie star, I think he's a bit delusional in that regard, a great actor its doubtful he'll be. His smartest move would be to play his arse off for another 2 or 3 years and get himself into the hall of fame.
I agree, if we can work a deal for Lito Sheppard that would give us a pro bowl corner and maybe a mid round pick.
Can someone please explain to me why when John Fox said that everyone accepts that they definitely won't trade Peppers, but when Parcells says that the only way Taylor won't be here is if he retires it is automatically a smokescreen.
Armando,
Of course their not "going on record" to state they have an interest in a player who is under contract with another team. Isn't that "tampering"?? sheesh, the press is always trying to bait people into trouble.
In response: Good stuff today, Armando. I just want Jason Taylor gone. He doesn't care about this team anymore, it should be abundently clear to everyone that his heart is in Hollywood, not South Florida. Get what you can, while you can!
You are entitled to your opinion but Jason Taylor always cares about the team. His heart is the team. I would hope that Jason will play one or two more years and retire as a Dolphin as he keeps the excitement rolling in the game.
TRADE JASON TAYLOR FOR BRADY QUINN
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